In a new podcast interview, Robert Mueller answered questions for the first time since testifying in the summer of 2019 about his two-year Russia investigation.
But for those hoping to hear insight into the special counsel inquiry, they will be disappointed to learn that the former FBI director was not even asked about the controversy that was a major chapter of the Trump presidency.
Former federal prosecutor Chuck Rosenberg, an ex-chief of staff to fired FBI Director James Comey and current MSNBC legal analyst, brought Mueller onto his podcast, The Oath, for a two-part interview, neither of which touch on Mueller’s time presiding over the controversial investigation that is being scrutinized by the current special counsel, John Durham.
“I should note what is not an either episode: that is, any detailed discussion of Bob’s work as special counsel, leading the investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election,” Rosenberg said in the episode that debuted on Wednesday. “Bob was abundantly clear when he testified before Congress about his work and his report and that the report spoke for itself. One of the things I learned working for Bob Mueller at the FBI is that you take this decent, honorable, honest, and courageous man at his word. When he says he does not want to talk about something, believe him.”
After Mueller’s investigation wrapped up in April 2019, he spoke at a press conference at the Justice Department the next month.
“I hope and expect this to be the only time I will speak to you in this manner,” Mueller said, adding, “There has been discussion about an appearance before Congress. Any testimony from this office would not go beyond our report. It contains our findings and analysis and the reasons for the decisions we made. We chose those words carefully, and the work speaks for itself, and the report is my testimony.”
The former special counsel agreed to appear before the House Judiciary and House Intelligence Committees in July 2019.
“We conducted an extensive investigation over two years. In writing the report, we stated the results of our investigation with precision. We scrutinized every word,” Mueller said. “I do not intend to summarize or describe the results of our work in a different way in the course of my testimony today. As I said on May 29: The report is my testimony. And I will stay within that text.”
Since then, Mueller has released only two other public statements.
In July, Mueller wrote an op-ed for the Washington Post following Trump’s granting of clemency to longtime Trump associate Roger Stone, with him arguing that Stone “remains a convicted felon, and rightfully so.”
The White House press office had harshly criticized the credibility of Mueller’s investigation.
“The collusion delusion spawned endless and farcical investigations, conducted at great taxpayer expense, looking for evidence that did not exist,” the White House said. “As it became clear that these witch hunts would never bear fruit, the Special Counsel’s Office resorted to process-based charges leveled at high-profile people in an attempt to manufacture the false impression of criminality lurking below the surface.”
Mueller pushed back, saying, “We made every decision in Stone’s case, as in all our cases, based solely on the facts and the law and in accordance with the rule of law. … Claims to the contrary are false.”
And in September, Mueller defended his investigation against criticism from former special counsel prosecutor Andrew Weissmann.
“It is not surprising that members of the Special Counsel’s Office did not always agree, but it is disappointing to hear criticism of our team based on incomplete information,” Mueller said in a statement. “When important decisions had to be made, I made them. I did so as I have always done, without any interest in currying favor or fear of the consequences. I stand by those decisions and by the conclusions of our investigation.”
Weissmann released a book in the summer criticizing aspects of the special counsel investigation, saying that “we could have done more.” Weissmann’s book trashed two major decisions: Mueller choosing not to subpoena Trump and Mueller’s report not reaching a decision on whether Trump obstructed justice.
Mueller explained his decision not to issue a Trump subpoena in his testimony last year.
“We were almost towards the end of our investigation, and we’d had little success in pushing to get the interview of the president,” Mueller said. “We decided that we did not want to exercise the subpoena powers because of the necessity of expediting the end of the investigation.”
Trump answered questions in writing.
Mueller’s report noted that “we determined not to apply an approach that could potentially result in a judgment that the President committed crimes,” but it laid out 10 possible instances of obstruction by Trump, including aborted efforts to remove Mueller.
Attorney General William Barr and then-Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein concluded that Trump had not obstructed justice.
In addition, Mueller’s team concluded that the Russians interfered in the 2016 election in a “sweeping and systematic fashion” but “did not establish that members of the Trump campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government.”
During the podcast interview, Rosenberg said, “Bob is a man of few words, and so, each of his words matters a lot, and when he speaks, which is not often, it is worth listening.” He added, “This interview with Bob Mueller is the only full one he has given since leaving public life. And it may be the only full one he gives.”
Mueller talked about his four younger sisters, his Navy officer father, his time at Princeton University and then in the Marine Corps and in Vietnam, his studies at the University of Virginia Law School, his work at the Justice Department, and being named FBI director in 2001.
“Is that a job you wanted?” Rosenberg asked.
“I did want to be back in government. … I wanted to serve again. And I’d always wanted to be in the FBI in one way or another,” Mueller said. “I didn’t think I’d be in this position. But, so it was.”
